Tom, I've been looking at the stats in the spreadsheet. PzII's(20mm gun) and early PzIII (37mm) with veteran crews have attack dice (AT) of 4 and 5 respectively v T-34a and KV1s with conscript crews have Reaction Dice of 5.
That doesn't seem realistic to me? The Germans watched in horror as their shells bounced off the armour of these tanks, they had to resort to luring them on to their heavy artillery which aimed at their tracks. Do you think we could keep the defence for these tanks as if the crew were of good standard of 6? We could either adjust the points total or I could use the standard Russian tactics of attacking in Waves: 1st T-26s and armoured cars, 2nd BTs, 3rd T-34s/KV1s.
The thing to remember with the rules is that the RD does not just represent the Armour of the vehicle but also the Moral and the training of the people in it.
In the initial invasion the Germans overran vast numbers of Russians no matter what vehicles they were mounted in and the stories about the effectiveness of the KV1's are few in the general scheme of things. Also the general reliability of these and the availability of Fuel etc. meant that very few actually got into combat.
If you are comparing the two army lists I provided then The Russians are all conscript to represent the poor quality of the Russians in this period of the war (-1RD, -1AP,-1AT) on the other hand the Germans who were veterans of at least three successful campaigns have been classed as +1RD, +1AP, +1AP.
If you take a look at the spreadsheets I posted earlier you can see how this works by changing the troop class (their is a drop down option to select). The spreadsheet will then amend the factors and points values accordingly.
My thoughts were that The Russians should be conscripts for the initial invasion and then go up to inexperience in 1942 onward with the Guards and experienced units in 1943 onward being Regular.
I have included an explanation of each army and my understanding and thoughts on there abilities etc. in the latest Rules document I posted recently.
Ok Tom, lets leave the rules as they are and give them a chance to work.
I agree with nearly everything you said. The Germans should be veterans and the Russians should be conscripts, it is right that the rules should reflect the competence and moral of the troops not just the quality of equipment and you are right the Germans were able to combat and defeat the KV1s and T-34s in their 1000s.
I just think that the Germans ought to work harder to take out the more modern Russian tanks. Pz IIs and early Pz IIIs were just not up to the job. The Germans combined arms was their secret to success: aircraft strikes, direct fire from heavy artillery (including the 88mm AA) plus Russian failings - running out of ammunition, diesel and general breakdowns all contributed. But I don't think 20/37 mm guns could contribute much. But we can think about that for another time.
I've placed an order with Heroic and Ross 10 days ago but it doesn't look like they are going to deliver in time so I may have to change my tanks to fit my models unless you have any early Russian armour?
If you look at the numbers of Russians you for for your points I think you will find that the Germans will still have a hard time of it. And remember that there is always opportunity fire so the Russian's are not as disadvantaged by their lack of command control as they seem to be.
Also note that the Germans are paying a large premium for their command control, Air power and High level artillery support etc (i.e. +10% on all their unit costs) Where as the Russians get a nice 10% reduction so they get 1100 points for every 900pts worth of Germans.
I understand your comments re PZ II & PZIII's v the better Russian tanks but the Higher quality of veteran status represents their better training and experience and therefore they get bonus's for their attacks. But on a straight Tank v Tank when both are regular this would be a different ball part wit the Russians getting +1RD for being regular and the Germans -1AT for being regular.
All my Armour is for the 1943 period so I cannot help you much there, but I do have plenty of infantry and support weapons.